Reese Wong on Coasting, The Diana Award and Building Impactful Communities

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Annie WM Yu: Reese, who do you want to be listening to our conversation today?

 

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Reese Wong: I want the type of person who may be still figuring out their life.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Welcome to Low to Grow, the podcast transforming life's toughest moments into opportunity for growth.

 

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Annie WM Yu: I'm Annie, a Forbes under 30 technology founder, whose entrepreneurship journey ran parallel to a mental health awakening.

 

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Annie WM Yu: In every episode, I sit down with inspiring individuals and delve into how they managed to turn their personal or professional challenges into opportunities for growth.

 

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Annie WM Yu: If you're facing uncertainty in your life, feeling down or simply need a kick of inspiration to keep moving forward, this is your space for the honest and uplifting conversations that you will want to hear.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Hit follow so you never miss an episode and let's dive in.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Today's guest is someone who proves that age is no barrier when it comes to global impact and visionary leadership.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Joining us is Reese Wong, a force of nature in the world of social entrepreneurship and communist building.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Reese is the award-winning founder of Isaiah Hong Kong, a youth-led nonprofit that enables global citizenship education through peer-to-peer and project-based learning.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Since 2019, Reese has brought on over 500 volunteers to launch over 30 projects on the United Nations SDG goals, even earning a nod from the NASDAQ.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Then moving from Hong Kong to London, Reese continued to build communities that challenged the status quo.

 

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Annie WM Yu: He is a World Economic Forum Global Shaper and also the President Curator of the Second London Hump.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Reese has been recognized for his work by the Diana Award in 2024, Aspen UK's Rising Leader and also the Royal Society of Arts.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Whether he's speaking on stages worldwide, advising governments or working with institutions like McKinsey and Ashoka, which is the world's leading community of social entrepreneurs, Reese brings bold ideas and quiet discipline to everything that he touches.

 

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Annie WM Yu: I am intrigued by what we're going to be discussing today.

 

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Annie WM Yu: And Reese, welcome to Low to Grow.

 

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Reese Wong: Thank you for having me.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Before we start, Reese, who do you want to be listening to our conversation today?

 

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Reese Wong: I think I want the type of person who may be still figuring out their life.

 

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Reese Wong: You know, maybe you're in your final steps of university.

 

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Reese Wong: Maybe you just entered university, but you're still figuring things out.

 

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Reese Wong: I want this episode to be for you because I think even though, you know, I've had this whole journey since I was 16, I think every step of the way still involves some sort of, I guess, lack of full clarity.

 

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Reese Wong: And it was always this type of, I guess, search for answers, but also, I guess, search for advice that I think really pushed me to where I am today.

 

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Reese Wong: So yeah, this is an episode for those who are still uncertain, for those who are figuring things out.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Fantastic, I cannot wait for you to go into that.

 

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Annie WM Yu: But first, let's rewind a bit, before Isaiah, before the awards.

 

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Annie WM Yu: So Reese, what was life like growing up for you?

 

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Reese Wong: I was born and raised in Hong Kong.

 

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Reese Wong: And I think really my whole life, I think I was pretty sheltered.

 

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Reese Wong: I think I was in a world where, you know, my parents was able to provide me with English language education, which I think made a big difference in my life.

 

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Reese Wong: I think I was brought up where I'd had access to international schools in Hong Kong.

 

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Reese Wong: So I think that really shaped this foundation where I was able to access a lot of opportunities because of the fact that I spoke English at a native level, and because I was able to tap into this international network as a result.

 

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Reese Wong: But yeah, I think very early on, I was still very academic, so it wasn't very entrepreneurial.

 

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Reese Wong: I was quite risk averse and, you know, I was doing the traditional type of activities you might expect, you know, debate, model the United Nations.

 

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Reese Wong: But I felt quite boxed in, and I think even then and even now, I was very introverted, and I think I never really at that point escaped out of my shell.

 

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Reese Wong: I didn't really find a sort of driving force, or really a reason for me to be doing things.

 

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Reese Wong: So there wasn't really a solid internal compass or will since, you know, the day I was born, I was sort of coasting, I was sort of on autopilot.

 

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Reese Wong: But that obviously changed around when I was 16, around 2019, when I think really my social entrepreneurship journey, but so much of where I am today could be traced back to that very early moment in my life as well.

 

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Annie WM Yu: What prompted you to begin your social entrepreneurship journey, Reese?

 

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Reese Wong: If I trace back a bit as well, something I did do during my childhood, I guess that is slightly notable, is I loved organizing things or arranging things.

 

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Reese Wong: At that point, there was no direction, there was no strategy, there was no thinking behind it.

 

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Reese Wong: Maybe it was the inclination.

 

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Reese Wong: But I remember in primary school, as you'd expect, there's a playground, there's a lot of toys, there's a lot of resources.

 

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Reese Wong: What I do is every break, I would basically myself and a group of friends, we would get to all the resources and all the toys ahead of time.

 

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Reese Wong: We'd get all of it and we'd set up a trading station.

 

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Reese Wong: That was what I called it back then, a trading station.

 

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Reese Wong: So we would set up a little hut, like a booth, and we would organize the trade of these toys.

 

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Reese Wong: It sounds absolutely wild looking back at it now, but I think even at that point, it was this inclination to organize or to lead.

 

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Reese Wong: But again, there was no strategy, there was no direction.

 

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Reese Wong: I think that was one of the early moments.

 

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Reese Wong: In high school, I still felt boxed in and very academic.

 

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Reese Wong: But I realized after doing an internship at a mental health charity actually, all the way back in 2019 when I was 16, that I found so much joy simply through learning by doing.

 

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Reese Wong: The magic of being able to see something through from creation or ideation to creation.

 

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Reese Wong: And that to me was such a great way for me to learn, to feel that I was generating some sort of artifact or deliverable and output.

 

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Reese Wong: And I think that really sparked in me this desire to work on projects, to scale projects.

 

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Reese Wong: And that led me to start my first non-profit organization, ISIA HK, which is now all about project-based learning, getting young people to work on projects, getting them to work with other young people for this sort of peer-to-peer model.

 

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Reese Wong: Ran that for three years, eventually passed it along, but it's still going quite well for two new leadership teams after me.

 

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Reese Wong: And that was really, I think, again, a journey that had its up and downs.

 

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Reese Wong: But I can trace so much of what I do to that decision, that moment where I realized, wow, I really like doing, really like learning by doing.

 

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Reese Wong: And that really sparked something in me.

 

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Annie WM Yu: That's great.

 

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Annie WM Yu: And it's so nice to hear that what you have created is there, it still runs on.

 

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Annie WM Yu: And I think it's the sign of good initial setup and good leadership to be able to pass on an organization to, you know, successes and their successes and for it to still run and to still grow by itself.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Super interesting that you mentioned that you had worked at a mental health charity.

 

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Annie WM Yu: How did you end up there?

 

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Reese Wong: So this was very early on.

 

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Reese Wong: I think I was in like, grade 10 and 11.

 

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Reese Wong: And I was very passionate about social issues.

 

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Reese Wong: But in the context of something like debate and then an MUN.

 

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Reese Wong: And I think the issue was that was very far removed from the real world.

 

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Reese Wong: You're debating things in a chamber.

 

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Reese Wong: You're never really doing anything about it.

 

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Reese Wong: But something that I noticed back in high school that was quite real was this sort of mental health problem that I think in international schools, people were discussing it more, but it was still quite secretized.

 

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Reese Wong: I think my angle especially was around sort of toxic masculinity specifically and mental health and doing some work while during my internship, writing some blogs and articles around it.

 

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Reese Wong: But it felt really tangible because that was a real problem and something that was quite real and material for high schools in Hong Kong versus a lot of the really macro issues that you'd debate in a competition or you'd sort of just theorize.

 

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Reese Wong: And I think that felt real.

 

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Reese Wong: And through that experience, yeah, that was a starting point, ended up doing a lot more different social issues.

 

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Reese Wong: But I think to me, mental health was something that was very, very real, very practical and something that you could experience at any point in time in high school especially.

 

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Annie WM Yu: You mentioned quite an interesting point earlier about how mental health, the conversation around it, whether it's in an international school in Hong Kong, could be perhaps a bit different to what it is across wider Hong Kong.

 

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Annie WM Yu: When you were still studying and growing up in Hong Kong, what was the conversation that you were hearing around mental health?

 

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Reese Wong: The angle was a lot around mindfulness.

 

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Reese Wong: I can remember back then there were already sort of workshops around being mindful and having these like meditation classes.

 

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Reese Wong: And I think there was a wider conversation along the lines of even substance abuse.

 

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Reese Wong: A lot of these topics, I guess, that wouldn't fit into the educational curriculum.

 

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Reese Wong: But I think the conversation of mental health was never really, even in international schools, very explicit or particularly informative.

 

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Reese Wong: It wasn't built into any course.

 

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Reese Wong: It was probably a guest speaker that came in or for one of these internships that a student might work on or for a service project.

 

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Reese Wong: So I think that it was a conversation that was happening.

 

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Reese Wong: But at that point, and this is 2018, 2019, it was still something that schools were figuring out how to really build in via an external provider, for example, through one of these charities or youth groups that they bring in a speaker.

 

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Reese Wong: But I don't think there was really a full-on strategy yet.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Interesting.

 

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Annie WM Yu: And you also mentioned toxic masculinity.

 

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Annie WM Yu: What does it mean?

 

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Reese Wong: Yeah.

 

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Reese Wong: So my understanding of it is that these traditional conceptions of masculinity, and I remember one of the blog posts I wrote, it was like linking back to this Macbeth quote about what makes someone a man.

 

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Reese Wong: And a lot of times, those conceptions actually hold you back because you're not able to fully express yourself, what you believe in, be in touch of your emotions.

 

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Reese Wong: But also as a result, you might not be actually a better leader because you're actually holding yourself back from being truly authentic.

 

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Reese Wong: So I think my view of traditional masculinity is, a lot of what is viewed as strength is sometimes unnaturally mesh to this notion of what it means to be a man, for example, and that can be very damaging for someone's mental health.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Is that something that you see either affects your life or perhaps friends of yours?

 

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Reese Wong: Yeah, I think for myself as well.

 

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Reese Wong: I think I don't adhere to that traditional model.

 

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Reese Wong: I think when you try to be authentic in your leadership, for example, for a lot of my events, there's this sense that, oh, you should put in, I guess in traditional event organizing, like less effort.

 

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Reese Wong: You should pretend that you don't care.

 

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Reese Wong: A lot of these, I guess, not necessarily just masculine, but these types of emotionally distant approaches for a lot of my work now, it's actually going the reverse.

 

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Reese Wong: It's being very intentional, very curated, very high touch, and trying to get to this level of deeper emotional connection.

 

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Reese Wong: So I think it's something I'm working on.

 

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Reese Wong: I think for a lot of my events, I realized, wow, people actually value and appreciate that versus this sort of low touch, mass skilled approach, very transactional way of like relationship building, for example.

 

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Annie WM Yu: I like how you were able to realize that even when you were at high school.

 

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Annie WM Yu: I also like what you said about traditional views of masculinity, and how that could actually be a bit detrimental to good leadership.

 

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Annie WM Yu: When you were first setting up Isaiah, how did you actually get it off the ground?

 

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Annie WM Yu: Because building something that's maybe just an idea to something with over 500 staff volunteers and delivering on these projects must have taken a lot of work.

 

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Annie WM Yu: What was your approach to getting it step by step?

 

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Reese Wong: The organization had a few advantages.

 

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Reese Wong: One was that in the ecosystem, which is Hong Kong, there wasn't really something at that scale and that level of coordination on that topic area at that point in time.

 

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Reese Wong: After we launched the organization a few years on, we see a lot more of this young, even high school social entrepreneurial culture come a bit.

 

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Reese Wong: But at that point, it wasn't ever really this type of organization.

 

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Reese Wong: People started their school newspaper, for example, their local-based service projects, but there was definitely something at this scale.

 

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Reese Wong: So the concept was very simple.

 

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Reese Wong: Initially, the whole concept wasn't really even a service or a product.

 

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Reese Wong: It was literally this idea of a network for people to talk about social issues.

 

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Reese Wong: We started off with issues like mental health, LGBT clubhouse rights, for example, just civic engagement more broadly.

 

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Reese Wong: But then we realized, oh, a network without a reason for being or a strong way to continually engage people, would dissolve over time.

 

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Reese Wong: It was very difficult to keep up the engagement.

 

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Reese Wong: It was simply just an abrogation of people.

 

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Reese Wong: At that point, I introduced a magazine, a very simple idea.

 

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Reese Wong: Gult had their own local magazines.

 

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Reese Wong: But simple pivot was this idea that it would be an inter-school magazine.

 

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Reese Wong: The novelty, the early movement of VantageDare allowed us to reach out to schools and say, hey, would you like your students to be contributors for this magazine?

 

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Reese Wong: I think a lot of the times, the issue with schools' outreach is that you ask for free promotion.

 

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Reese Wong: But in this case, we were presenting, I guess, that exchange of value.

 

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Reese Wong: We're saying, this is an opportunity for your students to contribute, get their work shared across this school network.

 

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Reese Wong: It's a great way for them to practice their skills and project-based skills.

 

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Reese Wong: They were willing to help us promote it.

 

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Reese Wong: As a result, we started off of five schools, 15 schools, and eventually, we had like 60 schools, and also people who started off as writers, editors, illustrators who ended up doing other things in the organization.

 

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Reese Wong: I think that was really the nitty-gritty of how it got started.

 

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Reese Wong: But I think the advantage was that, again, the concept was so easy, right?

 

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Reese Wong: A magazine, it's not something new or completely innovative or radical.

 

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Reese Wong: But the fact that we did it at scale and we were able to, I guess, move first allowed us to really expand quite a bit in the early years.

 

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Annie WM Yu: It's often those simple ideas that actually end up having the largest impact.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Reese, was there ever a moment where there was a project or perhaps something else within Isaiah?

 

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Annie WM Yu: It's something that you've really pulled your heart and spent a lot of time working on, but when it just didn't really work out?

 

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Reese Wong: Oh yeah, definitely a lot, quite a few.

 

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Reese Wong: There's a few, I think one was a sort of big one, was my attempt to really turn it into a full blown social enterprise.

 

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Reese Wong: So, graduated from high school, I actually took a gap year.

 

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Reese Wong: I was doing other things, I was working as well, but one of my missions was actually to really turn Isaiah into a self-sustaining, profit generating, service offering social enterprise.

 

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Reese Wong: Up until that point, we were operating mainly on grants.

 

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Reese Wong: We're very low cost as well, purely volunteer based, and the occasional grant that came through.

 

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Reese Wong: But I was really trying to figure out, is there a way to really take it to the next level in terms of products, services and offerings?

 

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Reese Wong: The conclusion was no.

 

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Reese Wong: I think the takeaway there was that I tried different strategies possibly like commercializing the magazine, working with schools, I guess from a B2B point of view as well.

 

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Reese Wong: But I think the takeaway there was that there are some things that you don't need to necessarily change.

 

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Reese Wong: So the reason the organization was able to do so well for the first few years was specifically because that it was purely volunteer led and there was a power to that.

 

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Reese Wong: The fact that the network of 400, 500 people who are dedicating time in this multi-departmental organization, and there was value in that, and that's such a powerful model.

 

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Reese Wong: But yeah, couldn't really crack turning it into a full blown social enterprise.

 

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Reese Wong: And I realized at the end of the day, I didn't really have to, the organization is still going well.

 

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Reese Wong: But it also made me look at different other types of business models, other ways to scale.

 

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Reese Wong: And of course, now I'm in London working on other projects as well.

 

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Reese Wong: But I think that was a very insightful lesson on, again, if something isn't broken, you might not actually need to fix it or innovate for the sake of innovating.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Love that.

 

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Annie WM Yu: I actually really, really do agree with what you said about not fixing something that isn't broken and how sometimes some structures in some organizations are just good the way that they are.

 

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Annie WM Yu: And they're not meant to be scaled because if they scale, then you lose that personal touch and the actual impact that comes from them.

 

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Annie WM Yu: And almost, you know, it's the magic that goes behind it.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Interesting.

 

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Annie WM Yu: So Reese, I know that you mentioned that you grew up in Hong Kong and then you moved to the UK.

 

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Annie WM Yu: It's two very different cultures.

 

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Annie WM Yu: Did you ever feel like you were straddling two worlds?

 

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Annie WM Yu: And were there any challenges that you found?

 

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Annie WM Yu: Or, you know, were there any, perhaps, benefits that you found being in that particular position?

 

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Reese Wong: Yeah, for sure.

 

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Reese Wong: I think there are definitely quite a few struggles, right?

 

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Reese Wong: Like, just initially figuring out the landscape, the ecosystem, both, like, personally and professionally.

 

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Reese Wong: There's what opportunities are out there?

 

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Reese Wong: How do I make the most time out of my university days?

 

00:18:46.380 --> 00:18:51.960

Reese Wong: What sort of network should I perhaps join or people I should meet?

 

00:18:51.960 --> 00:19:00.740

Reese Wong: The way I was able to overcome that was this, I guess, entrepreneurialism that I took from a lot of my nonprofit journey.

 

00:19:00.740 --> 00:19:02.560

Reese Wong: I started this journey all the way back in 2019.

 

00:19:03.840 --> 00:19:06.820

Reese Wong: I started university in 2022.

 

00:19:06.820 --> 00:19:25.840

Reese Wong: And because of this habits I built or these sort of reps, I call it, of just being able to put myself out there, go to coffee chats, go to events, organize my own events, put myself up for leadership roles, a lot of the things compounded.

 

00:19:25.840 --> 00:19:44.960

Reese Wong: So I realized that actually when I landed in London by 2022, I already had a head start because I already had this habit of being challenged, being in uncomfortable new spaces, being the youngest person in a room, being the only Asian person in a room.

 

00:19:44.960 --> 00:20:00.400

Reese Wong: A lot of these new situations, I was used to or I sort of built like a resilience to, because I started so early and I had like four years to, I think really push myself in all these different new ways.

 

00:20:00.680 --> 00:20:03.240

Reese Wong: So I think that definitely did help.

 

00:20:03.240 --> 00:20:04.460

Annie WM Yu: That makes sense.

 

00:20:04.460 --> 00:20:11.920

Annie WM Yu: When you were speaking, you actually made me think about my really early days of founding Quantum Dice, which happened straight after I finished my masters.

 

00:20:11.920 --> 00:20:21.900

Annie WM Yu: And when we were initially doing business development and going to conferences and attending round tables, it was with some quite senior level people across the country and also globally in our industry.

 

00:20:21.900 --> 00:20:38.120

Annie WM Yu: And there was so many times when I would look around the room and I would think I am in a room with people who are at least two or three decades older than me, with a lot more industry experience, whether it's in science or whether it's in commercialization.

 

00:20:38.120 --> 00:20:46.240

Annie WM Yu: And I would at times feel quite insecure, but then at times I just thought, well, there's a reason why I've been invited to this room.

 

00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:51.180

Annie WM Yu: And I have a reason of wanting to build what I'm building with my company.

 

00:20:51.180 --> 00:20:54.920

Annie WM Yu: And I need to make sure that I make the best use out of this opportunity.

 

00:20:54.920 --> 00:21:05.800

Annie WM Yu: Completely agree with what you said about, it's that constant exposure to rooms where you are different and to situations that make you feel uncomfortable that actually allows you to really grow.

 

00:21:05.800 --> 00:21:12.600

Annie WM Yu: And as you said, gives you perhaps a head start and there's more of a sense of comfort when you next enter these rooms.

 

00:21:12.620 --> 00:21:18.680

Annie WM Yu: Question for you then, because you've actually taken on leadership roles from quite a young age, so it was 16.

 

00:21:18.680 --> 00:21:23.500

Annie WM Yu: Did that ever come with a pressure to appear that you have everything figured out?

 

00:21:25.020 --> 00:21:38.100

Reese Wong: I think so, even now I think when I'm now 22, there's a sort of expectation that once you do something very well, that you're able to keep doing better and bigger and greater things.

 

00:21:38.100 --> 00:21:40.600

Reese Wong: And I think that's definitely a pressure I still feel now.

 

00:21:40.600 --> 00:21:47.200

Reese Wong: But I think what helps is also, again, back to that Raps thing, opportunities compound over time.

 

00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:53.280

Reese Wong: I once traced back a lot of the things I do today and I was like, hmm, what would be the original source?

 

00:21:53.280 --> 00:21:57.920

Reese Wong: Or, yeah, what is the first cause of a lot of these opportunities?

 

00:21:57.920 --> 00:22:13.340

Reese Wong: And it was exactly that step I took at 16 to start this nonprofit, which went to this first work experience or led to this one connection, which opened this door, which opened that other work opportunity and so on and so forth.

 

00:22:13.340 --> 00:22:15.380

Reese Wong: So I think, yeah, there's that pressure.

 

00:22:15.380 --> 00:22:28.660

Reese Wong: But I also think there's that sense of responsibility as well, because of all the opportunities I've been given since starting this organization, to really make the best use of it and to really push myself as well.

 

00:22:28.660 --> 00:22:37.940

Reese Wong: It is pressure, but I think it's also intrinsic in a way now, where I use it as a way to channel myself to do more and to create more impact.

 

00:22:39.580 --> 00:22:45.280

Annie WM Yu: Your conscientiousness in how you approach work and also your studies and also your life is very inspiring.

 

00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:51.040

Annie WM Yu: I also read that last year, you were awarded the Princess Diana Award.

 

00:22:51.040 --> 00:22:55.840

Annie WM Yu: Could you share a bit more about what led to that amazing milestone that you had?

 

00:22:55.840 --> 00:22:56.860

Reese Wong: Yeah.

 

00:22:56.860 --> 00:23:02.120

Reese Wong: Basically, three different tries throughout my whole life for that award.

 

00:23:02.120 --> 00:23:07.880

Reese Wong: I think the first time I tried for it was like just before university, 2020.

 

00:23:07.880 --> 00:23:15.280

Reese Wong: I tried again in like 2022, and then in 2004, I finally did get the award, and that was a really satisfying moment.

 

00:23:15.360 --> 00:23:26.200

Reese Wong: I think, I guess, a lot of it, again, trace back to how taking social action all the way back really did shape the trajectory of my life.

 

00:23:26.200 --> 00:23:41.060

Reese Wong: The award is really a reflection of having started making that choice quite early on, and I think really shaping my life dedicated towards public service, towards social entrepreneurship and innovation and education.

 

00:23:41.060 --> 00:23:43.840

Reese Wong: And I think, yeah, that was an amazing moment.

 

00:23:44.920 --> 00:23:58.280

Annie WM Yu: Reese, can I ask, because most of the social entrepreneurs that I meet when I speak to normally have quite a personal reason for why they decided to go into other public service or do something that's more social impact based rather than for profit.

 

00:23:59.540 --> 00:24:02.840

Annie WM Yu: Are you comfortable sharing what your personal drive is?

 

00:24:02.840 --> 00:24:03.820

Reese Wong: Yeah.

 

00:24:03.820 --> 00:24:14.620

Reese Wong: I think my drive is this sort of deep rooted sense that when you're sort of brought into this world, you sort of have limited amount of time.

 

00:24:14.620 --> 00:24:19.040

Reese Wong: I think they say in your career, you only really have 80,000 hours, right?

 

00:24:19.040 --> 00:24:26.540

Reese Wong: And as a result, I sort of look back and I think about, what do I want to achieve with this 80,000 hours that will comprise my career?

 

00:24:27.420 --> 00:24:31.820

Reese Wong: And I also think about what is this legacy I want to leave behind?

 

00:24:31.820 --> 00:24:43.140

Reese Wong: And I think public service, social entrepreneurship, a lot of this work around systems change, or just entrepreneurship more broadly, is always looking to tackle these huge problems or looking to tackle problems at scale.

 

00:24:43.140 --> 00:24:59.840

Reese Wong: And I think to me, is this deep sense of that it is the best use of my time to be trying at least to solve these problems or to push myself towards making the biggest impact possible in the very limited amount of time one has on this planet.

 

00:24:59.840 --> 00:25:05.340

Reese Wong: So I think that's what really drove me, is that the sense of, this is the best use of my time.

 

00:25:05.340 --> 00:25:12.880

Reese Wong: This is where I could leave the greatest amount of a footprint and impact and have the most counterfactual impact as well.

 

00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:16.440

Reese Wong: Or is this sense of, I should be doing something more.

 

00:25:16.440 --> 00:25:18.640

Reese Wong: I have this opportunity to do more.

 

00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:22.560

Reese Wong: And impact is something that is beyond oneself, right?

 

00:25:22.560 --> 00:25:23.860

Reese Wong: It's very outward facing.

 

00:25:23.920 --> 00:25:32.860

Reese Wong: You're able to actually create a ripple effect or a change in someone else and eventually possibly even assist them.

 

00:25:32.860 --> 00:25:42.920

Annie WM Yu: Who or what do you think helped you shape this really innate desire of yours to create impact and impact that really lasts?

 

00:25:42.920 --> 00:25:44.220

Reese Wong: Yeah, I think my parents for sure.

 

00:25:44.220 --> 00:25:45.480

Reese Wong: So they're both like academics.

 

00:25:45.480 --> 00:25:48.340

Reese Wong: So there's always that sense of, I guess, for a different way.

 

00:25:48.340 --> 00:25:54.060

Reese Wong: And this is through, I guess, research and education, a way to like give back or to give forward.

 

00:25:54.060 --> 00:26:02.420

Reese Wong: And I think that is also my same sense where the two big things I want to solve is, one, this idea of human potential.

 

00:26:02.420 --> 00:26:08.620

Reese Wong: Again, back into my journey, starting at 16, all these different moments, there was no real strategy behind it.

 

00:26:08.620 --> 00:26:15.000

Reese Wong: It was because I had the right exposure, the right environment, but also the initiative to take advantage of it.

 

00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:19.380

Reese Wong: But a lot of the times, you might not see that play out again and again.

 

00:26:19.480 --> 00:26:23.520

Reese Wong: If I was in any different environment, it might not be the sort of same outcome.

 

00:26:23.520 --> 00:26:29.340

Reese Wong: I realized that there is so much to do with like, how do you maximize a young person's potential?

 

00:26:29.340 --> 00:26:45.720

Reese Wong: How do you let them see the full scope of opportunities that they could work towards, whether that's career, whether that's university options, subject choices, the big force that I've been working a lot on is this idea of how do you actually maximize a young person's potential.

 

00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:49.540

Reese Wong: Another bucket is this idea of community building.

 

00:26:49.540 --> 00:26:53.280

Reese Wong: So I think I see myself very much even now still an introvert.

 

00:26:53.280 --> 00:27:01.480

Reese Wong: And I realized so many times, there's so many situations where events were just not properly created or were not very intentional, very big rooms.

 

00:27:01.480 --> 00:27:04.840

Reese Wong: And, you know, as someone who's very introverted, you might get socially anxious.

 

00:27:04.840 --> 00:27:11.000

Reese Wong: I know I have in a lot of these very large, uncoordinated environments and crowds.

 

00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:17.320

Reese Wong: A big thing that I'm trying to solve for a lot of my projects is, can you bring people together in a better way?

 

00:27:17.320 --> 00:27:22.600

Reese Wong: Whether that's for dinners, whether that's for the way you organize bootcamps, a level of intention and creation.

 

00:27:22.600 --> 00:27:26.340

Reese Wong: These are like these big issues that really drive me.

 

00:27:26.340 --> 00:27:32.080

Reese Wong: But I think again, that internal drive, I think comes back from my own struggles with these issues.

 

00:27:32.080 --> 00:27:40.900

Reese Wong: But I guess also the sense that I have given this opportunity through my, sure, my own initiative, but also by happenstance.

 

00:27:40.900 --> 00:27:41.960

Reese Wong: How do I pay it forward?

 

00:27:42.560 --> 00:27:51.740

Reese Wong: And how do I really help other people, young people, realize their potential, but also how people better connect with one another?

 

00:27:53.080 --> 00:27:55.060

Annie WM Yu: That's a very beautiful way to look at the world.

 

00:27:55.060 --> 00:27:58.780

Annie WM Yu: And thank you for all that you are doing.

 

00:27:58.780 --> 00:28:12.300

Annie WM Yu: Reese, for some of our listeners, and they might be university students or they might just be starting out in their career, say they are also introverted and they are also identify with being socially anxious in these situations.

 

00:28:12.300 --> 00:28:21.500

Annie WM Yu: What are some pieces of advice that you would give to them to help them be able to connect more with others either in their professional community or in their personal community?

 

00:28:21.500 --> 00:28:21.680

Annie WM Yu: 100%.

 

00:28:22.180 --> 00:28:24.700

Reese Wong: So I think two major strands here.

 

00:28:24.720 --> 00:28:31.060

Reese Wong: One is that instead of going to events, you could take the step to organize your own.

 

00:28:31.060 --> 00:28:36.960

Reese Wong: And again, that may sound daunting initially, and that sounds even worse potentially than going to an event.

 

00:28:36.960 --> 00:28:40.180

Reese Wong: But what that gives you is control, but also creation.

 

00:28:40.180 --> 00:28:44.060

Reese Wong: It allows you to set the terms of how you're going to engage with other people.

 

00:28:44.060 --> 00:28:46.900

Reese Wong: And also is a great excuse to reach out to other people.

 

00:28:46.900 --> 00:28:51.900

Reese Wong: So I think that's one is that you can create your own spaces, set your own terms.

 

00:28:51.900 --> 00:28:54.660

Reese Wong: And number two is also creating magnets.

 

00:28:54.660 --> 00:29:01.700

Reese Wong: So it's similar to sort of one, but it's this idea of just pursuing your passions, but also communicating your work.

 

00:29:01.840 --> 00:29:09.160

Reese Wong: So whether that's for personal branding, building a public, but you create excuses for other people to reach out as well.

 

00:29:09.160 --> 00:29:11.960

Reese Wong: So with number one, you have an excuse to reach out to other people.

 

00:29:11.960 --> 00:29:20.900

Reese Wong: Or number two, you create magnets, interesting things that you share and you share a lot about, which gives other people an excuse to reach out to you.

 

00:29:20.900 --> 00:29:28.880

Reese Wong: As a result, you have a very good system of outbound and inbound that allows you to build relationships on your terms in both of these scenarios.

 

00:29:28.880 --> 00:29:30.160

Reese Wong: And I think that's helped a lot for me.

 

00:29:30.760 --> 00:29:47.940

Reese Wong: And I think for an introvert, rather than this very scattered approach of just going to random events, or just trying to send random cold emails or messages out to people, you can really optimize it for both outbound and inbound to really create your own network.

 

00:29:49.220 --> 00:29:49.800

Annie WM Yu: That's great.

 

00:29:49.800 --> 00:29:50.880

Annie WM Yu: So create your own network.

 

00:29:50.880 --> 00:29:56.080

Annie WM Yu: I know they take more of a leading role so that you have something to do at an event.

 

00:29:56.080 --> 00:30:11.860

Annie WM Yu: And I actually feel like a lot of the introverts I speak to, I also share that recommendation, which is if you have a task to be doing at a networking event, then naturally people will have a reason to come towards you, which is the magnet as you so eloquently described there.

 

00:30:11.860 --> 00:30:25.460

Annie WM Yu: So Reese, another question for you, because you've had to balance studying at a competitive university, building a community, doing the World Economic Forum Global Shapers for the London Hub.

 

00:30:25.460 --> 00:30:30.760

Annie WM Yu: What are some lessons that you have learnt about balance in order to prevent burnout?

 

00:30:30.760 --> 00:30:35.100

Reese Wong: Firstly, it's being in a position where you can set boundaries.

 

00:30:35.100 --> 00:30:37.980

Reese Wong: So a lot of the times as a student, that might not be realistic.

 

00:30:37.980 --> 00:30:41.740

Reese Wong: You have lectures, classes, you have responsibilities.

 

00:30:41.740 --> 00:30:55.640

Reese Wong: But what I found very useful is I'm oftentimes, if I'm in a leadership position, or if I'm the one reaching out or setting up an event, you have more control over when these events take place and at what time.

 

00:30:55.640 --> 00:30:58.440

Reese Wong: As a result, you have more control over your calendar.

 

00:30:58.440 --> 00:31:06.780

Reese Wong: So I think that's actually one nifty tip is, again, maybe counterintuitive, but try putting yourself in situations where you can set the agenda.

 

00:31:06.780 --> 00:31:11.960

Reese Wong: But I think secondly, it's also, again, timeboxing this ruthless prioritization.

 

00:31:11.960 --> 00:31:24.460

Reese Wong: I struggle with this too even now, but it's being able to say within a month or within a year, what is actually the thing I want to accomplish and is this specific engagement or thing going to contribute towards that?

 

00:31:24.460 --> 00:31:25.300

Reese Wong: That could be one.

 

00:31:25.300 --> 00:31:31.880

Reese Wong: But also secondly, if you look at how much time you're spending, does it accurately reflect what you want to achieve?

 

00:31:31.880 --> 00:31:36.380

Reese Wong: If not, you can change it around and you could focus on things that actually get you to where you want to be.

 

00:31:36.380 --> 00:31:44.600

Reese Wong: So I think there's all of that, but I think it's, especially if you're someone who's ambitious, who's doing a lot of things, you might still end up in a point of burnout.

 

00:31:44.600 --> 00:31:54.160

Reese Wong: What has helped me as well is being in this state of mind, where I think I'm able to be resilient, but also be quite calm.

 

00:31:54.160 --> 00:31:56.300

Reese Wong: So I don't get stressed easily, which is a good thing.

 

00:31:56.300 --> 00:32:01.160

Reese Wong: I'm able to, I think, really see challenges or setbacks.

 

00:32:01.280 --> 00:32:02.380

Reese Wong: There's something exciting.

 

00:32:02.380 --> 00:32:04.500

Reese Wong: It's something that is a learning opportunity as well.

 

00:32:04.500 --> 00:32:07.900

Reese Wong: And I think that mindset shift is also quite great.

 

00:32:07.900 --> 00:32:18.320

Reese Wong: Having this internal locus of a control, where I don't necessarily overthink about things that are outside my locus of control, outside of things I can control.

 

00:32:18.320 --> 00:32:24.060

Reese Wong: And I think that really helped you put a very solid anchor to be just more resilient and more mindful.

 

00:32:26.000 --> 00:32:31.700

Annie WM Yu: Is that something that you've always had, or is that a quality that you've had to develop?

 

00:32:31.700 --> 00:32:36.860

Reese Wong: I think definitely I had some inclination of it early on, but also something I developed.

 

00:32:36.860 --> 00:32:42.500

Reese Wong: For example, let's say you send out many, many, many, many applications.

 

00:32:42.500 --> 00:32:51.980

Reese Wong: And if it gets back to that exposure point, and let's say you keep aiming higher and higher, perhaps you get a whole suite of rejections, and you have a whole set of setbacks.

 

00:32:51.980 --> 00:33:08.280

Reese Wong: But at a certain point, you realize that you keep getting rejections, but you keep still achieving your goals, and you keep sort of moving along these lines, where you just realize that a lot of these rejections, a lot of these setbacks, a lot of these missed opportunities are just part of the journey.

 

00:33:08.280 --> 00:33:33.700

Reese Wong: And I realized that now whenever something doesn't go the way I want it to, or I don't get this, let's say, award or this opportunity, I'm totally unfazed because I realized that as you set yourself up for more ambitious goals, you're also probably going to face more and more rejections, regardless of compounding effects, regardless of your ability to really spiral upwards.

 

00:33:33.700 --> 00:33:40.460

Reese Wong: You're still going to face more rejections simply because you're operating at a higher level or you're improving yourself.

 

00:33:40.460 --> 00:33:44.620

Reese Wong: So I think, again, I see it as a natural part of my journey, but I think it's something that took time.

 

00:33:44.620 --> 00:33:52.300

Reese Wong: It took that early set of rejections, set of missed opportunities, and seeing a lot more of it definitely, I think, helped as well.

 

00:33:52.300 --> 00:34:02.880

Annie WM Yu: I like that, actually, because what you're saying is when you're facing rejections or when things don't go as you hope they would, zoom out and look at the bigger picture.

 

00:34:02.880 --> 00:34:07.440

Annie WM Yu: I think I see this graphic where it shows success isn't linear.

 

00:34:07.440 --> 00:34:10.260

Annie WM Yu: Over a longer period of time, it's going upwards.

 

00:34:10.260 --> 00:34:19.380

Annie WM Yu: But then nitty gritty, as you were saying, so in the day-to-day, you're going to have ups and then downs, and sometimes you might have loads of downs before getting one up.

 

00:34:19.420 --> 00:34:30.320

Annie WM Yu: What you're saying that made me think about when we were doing our first fundraise and we literally spoke to 100 different investors and only three said yes, but we only needed three to say yes.

 

00:34:30.320 --> 00:34:37.080

Annie WM Yu: It's also about having a balance and also having that grit to keep going, even when things initially don't work out.

 

00:34:37.080 --> 00:34:59.520

Annie WM Yu: What you said earlier also about if you're operating at a slightly higher level, the more your career grows or the deeper your career grows, the higher the opportunities are, but also because they are larger opportunities, then if you don't get one, then it seems like a larger failure, but it's actually you have tried, and it's the trying that counts and it's not given up.

 

00:34:59.520 --> 00:35:13.200

Annie WM Yu: Earlier when you were saying that last year in 2024, when you were awarded the Princess Diana Award, which is a super prestigious award, I loved how you were able to just say straight away, well, it's the third time that I applied for it, and I was actually rejected twice before.

 

00:35:13.200 --> 00:35:17.080

Annie WM Yu: But I love that you just kept going and you had that believing yourself.

 

00:35:17.180 --> 00:35:27.280

Annie WM Yu: But of course, from the time of your first application to your last application, you must have done a lot of work on your project and also on yourself in order to be awarded that.

 

00:35:27.280 --> 00:35:29.860

Annie WM Yu: So congratulations to you.

 

00:35:29.860 --> 00:35:39.980

Annie WM Yu: One question, and this is something that I love to ask and also learn from people who are very busy and who like to keep a lot of plates spinning.

 

00:35:39.980 --> 00:35:45.880

Annie WM Yu: Were there any personal sacrifices that you have had to make in order for your career to go well?

 

00:35:45.880 --> 00:35:46.400

Reese Wong: A lot of it.

 

00:35:46.560 --> 00:36:06.140

Reese Wong: I think a big one is a conventional university experience would possibly look like some divide of maybe spending 50, 60% of your time on academics, maybe the remaining 30% of the time on some form of social life, and then maybe the remaining 20% on careers.

 

00:36:06.140 --> 00:36:11.200

Reese Wong: Maybe that's a sort of archetype of a conventional, well-balanced student.

 

00:36:11.200 --> 00:36:18.600

Reese Wong: But I think a lot of it, because of this sort of fixation or this desire, I think, to do more.

 

00:36:18.600 --> 00:36:36.500

Reese Wong: And again, like the natural busyness of just working on so many projects, I think a lot of the times that balance is definitely off whack, where academics have to end up being like a 10%, 20% social life as well, is therefore so inextricably connected with your work, with your projects.

 

00:36:36.500 --> 00:36:50.740

Reese Wong: And I think that definitely is a sacrifice is, you know, some may say you spend your university time really having a lot of time for introspection, for self discovery, for slowing down.

 

00:36:50.740 --> 00:36:56.280

Reese Wong: But I think as someone who's busy, as someone who's very ambitious, you can still find time for that.

 

00:36:56.280 --> 00:37:12.440

Reese Wong: A lot of times you find yourself simply within three years, for example, just having not that much time to really sit back and fully reflect or to really enjoy the slower, quieter things of being a university student.

 

00:37:12.520 --> 00:37:15.820

Reese Wong: And I think London itself definitely impacts that as well.

 

00:37:15.820 --> 00:37:26.760

Reese Wong: The fact that for us at LLC, you walk out the door and you immediately, you set foot in the city and you're surrounded by so many opportunities and the abundant things that you can do.

 

00:37:26.760 --> 00:37:30.100

Reese Wong: So I think there's that sacrifice is the past few years.

 

00:37:30.100 --> 00:37:33.640

Reese Wong: I definitely didn't feel much like a university student.

 

00:37:34.660 --> 00:37:36.940

Annie WM Yu: So what's next for you, Reese?

 

00:37:36.940 --> 00:37:55.080

Reese Wong: Yeah, a lot more community building, a lot more self-initiated entrepreneurial projects, running a few more startup communities, doing a few more talks as well, and then deciding between a career in government, but also the private sector and management consulting as well.

 

00:37:55.080 --> 00:38:02.960

Reese Wong: Hopefully to do both, have a world where I can really combine that expertise, but yeah, still figuring things out.

 

00:38:02.960 --> 00:38:10.340

Annie WM Yu: I'm very excited to see where you'll end up, although I'm sure that I will hear a lot of other activities that you're doing in the meantime as well.

 

00:38:10.340 --> 00:38:13.540

Annie WM Yu: Two questions to bring this to a close.

 

00:38:13.540 --> 00:38:18.180

Annie WM Yu: First question is, who are three people that you look up to?

 

00:38:18.180 --> 00:38:26.120

Annie WM Yu: And the second question is, what is one thing that you think will allow more people to have better mental health?

 

00:38:26.120 --> 00:38:29.940

Reese Wong: So I think for the first three, there's quite a few.

 

00:38:29.940 --> 00:38:48.000

Reese Wong: I'd say firstly, my parents for sure, maybe that's one or two, where I think it's this, I guess, conscientiousness or this desire to just be able to do hard work, which I think is something that really, really life has set me up in terms of as a foundation.

 

00:38:48.000 --> 00:39:01.140

Reese Wong: But I guess the other category, and it's mainly and maybe more an archetype than a specific person, but a lot of the people that I surround myself with and I see a lot more are people who just have very high degree of agency.

 

00:39:01.140 --> 00:39:06.960

Reese Wong: And some of them are entrepreneurs, some of them are working in policy, some of them are working on completely different areas.

 

00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:30.620

Reese Wong: But one thing that I really admire and look up to is this sort of uninhibited sense of agency and this idea that one's life, no matter the circumstance or the external environment, is within your control and that you are able to control your outcome.

 

00:39:30.620 --> 00:39:32.460

Reese Wong: And they put that into action, right?

 

00:39:32.520 --> 00:39:48.060

Reese Wong: Whether that is for building a company, but that is for finding very unconventional third doors to different opportunities, but that's simply being uninhibited by external pressure, by stereotype, by expectation.

 

00:39:48.060 --> 00:39:50.060

Reese Wong: And I think that's something I'm still working towards.

 

00:39:50.060 --> 00:39:53.480

Reese Wong: And I think that's something I look up to a lot.

 

00:39:53.480 --> 00:40:01.300

Reese Wong: I think for the second question, I think my advice would be, again, to really set boundaries.

 

00:40:01.480 --> 00:40:07.780

Reese Wong: And I think back to what I mentioned is try, put yourself in situations where you are in control.

 

00:40:07.780 --> 00:40:20.660

Reese Wong: It allows you to have more control over your life, but also as a result, you are in a better position to set boundaries and to, again, really think about what are the things am I working on in a given day?

 

00:40:20.660 --> 00:40:23.080

Reese Wong: Are they aligning with what I want to achieve?

 

00:40:23.080 --> 00:40:27.220

Reese Wong: And as a result, have this greater sense of fulfillment and self-actualization.

 

00:40:27.800 --> 00:40:42.380

Reese Wong: So I think that's my advice is find ways or systems or approaches, communities where you can set the agenda and you can set the boundaries that allow you to fully realize your potential.

 

00:40:42.380 --> 00:40:45.260

Annie WM Yu: Reese, thank you so much for sharing that.

 

00:40:45.260 --> 00:40:48.260

Annie WM Yu: It's been such a pleasure to have you on my podcast.

 

00:40:48.260 --> 00:40:52.260

Annie WM Yu: And I feel like I've learned a lot from the insights that you shared as well.

 

00:40:52.260 --> 00:40:58.500

Annie WM Yu: And to me, your desire to give back to the community and to the world in general is loud and clear.

 

00:40:58.500 --> 00:41:02.600

Annie WM Yu: And I am so excited to see what you're going to be doing next.

 

00:41:02.600 --> 00:41:02.920

Reese Wong: Amazing.

 

00:41:02.920 --> 00:41:03.900

Reese Wong: Thank you so much for having me.

 

00:41:03.900 --> 00:41:06.160

Reese Wong: This was a great conversation.

 

00:41:06.160 --> 00:41:10.200

Annie WM Yu: That's a wrap for today's episode of the Low to Grow podcast.

 

00:41:10.200 --> 00:41:17.080

Annie WM Yu: If it resonated with you, leave a review and hit follow to help more people to find important conversations.

 

00:41:17.080 --> 00:41:19.020

Annie WM Yu: Keep growing and see you next time.